Unintelligent Design

[artimus]

Hey, I'm a new member here but I have something I wanna talk about. Sorry in advance if I offend anyone. I don't have anything against any kind of religion, I just have something against morons who confuse belief with science. There's a difference.

So, some schools are teaching Intelligent Design now. Goody. BUT WAIT! What is Intelligent Design, you ask? Well, Johnny Username, let me tell you.

Some thousands of years ago, we, humans, were created in a cute little garden that we were kicked out of faster than a fur in the republican congress. It was a simple creation and everything just kind of was.

BUT WAIT!

That's what you call a belief. There is absolutely no evidence to support it so this theory is based purely on faith. It is not scientific.

Now another theory is called the "Evolutionist Theory" This theory states that through a chain of procreation, organisms changed, evolved, and adapted to their environment eventually resulting in the current food chain and animal kingdom. This process happened over billions of years, trillions of years, maybe even quadrafalligicantistillion...years. I don't know, I wasn't around then.

Now, of course we all know the polarity of the two beliefs and that religious scholars have debated with scientists as to how we really came to be, and eventually we came to a decision as a people: Children would learn about evolution in schools, they'd learn about creationism in church. Good balance, I think we reached a good understanding.

BUT WAIT!

Now, in the future, we're back to debate. And instead of solving our problems with murders and fun times had by all, the board of education has collaborated with religious institutions to bring you Intelligent Design. Also known as religiulous studious creationus

So, bad latin aside, some schools are now abandoning evolution and teaching creationism as the accepted method of creation. This, of course, will hamper the education of many a doctor everywhere who will now accept that those nasty, deadly little viruses are here for a reason and that we should all just let them run their course. We'll be going somewhere great anyway, right?

Well, whatever your belief is your own, and again I'm not going to bash any beliefs. What I am going to say is...why? Come on! We had an understanding! church gets  to create, school gets to evolve. It was going so well! We had, like, polio vaccines and some other cool stuff! I mean, none of us scientists were trying to push our beliefs in your churches. Instead the church has to take away a good theory just like PTA moms take away anything with...well, anything, hah.

What's my freaking point, you ask? Well it's....hm....oh yeah. Stoppit! Let the schools teach evolution and you teach creationism! I don't wanna have cancer and have some idiot doctor say "Well, the bad news is your gonna die. The good news is maybe God will give you chemo if you pray hard enough. What's that? You say you want chemo here? What are ya, some kinda heathen?"

Please, let me have my chemo. I mean, my evolution.

Again, if you are offended by this very well (not really at all) researched rant, I am truly sorry. And if you happen to be one of the guys I stole several of the little jokes from, it's not stealing if no one else knows where they came from. Also, sucker. Thanks for reading, and also sorry if a thread like this exists. I didn't see one.

[Dan Witty]

I agree with you on the whole, Artimus; that creationism as it stands is unfounded and rather a dangerous tool in the wrong hands, but I also believe there is some merit to it. I also believe that evolutionism is beyond doubt, but for some reason, the two beliefs just don't see eye to eye, and I think it is not because of incompatibility, so much as a much overlooked misunderstanding.

Evolution aims to discover the interconnectivity of all existing species, but lays no claim to the origins of them, although the theory seeks (thanks to Darwin's poorly titled book, I think this is were the problem got its roots). Creationism, on the other hand, attempts that much more challenging leap of logic, and clings to the only answer they have yet some up with, for reasons I will not go into for now. But for the most part, they cannot really be proven wrong. All things considered, our very existence is just as probable as the existence of such a deity as described in religious text. Really is seems like the two groups are running in opposite directions, and crashed somewhere in the middle, both have a valid much desirable destination, they just decided to argue about who's at fault.

[Jad'Thor]

i hate creationism. if i were told that my school would be teaching creationism i'd move school. if the entire A.C.T started teaching Creationism i'd move state, if the entire country started teaching it...well this would go on until I live in some strange alternative universe. i usually don't have a problem with religion, UNLESS it gets in my way, then i get ticked off and i get REALLY angry. if they (what ever religon(s) it might be) want religion to invade my school they can go !@#$%^&* them selves!!

(might be a little harsh but in im a REALLY bad mood)

[artimus]

Dan: Honestly, and I'm hesitant to talk about religion in this board as many forums only pretend to have free speech, I think that the people who enforce the creationist theory operate on one of two, or maybe both motivations:

1. The compulsive need to make everyone think the way they do

2. The fear that they'll be smitten if people believe something different.

Honestly, I think that a lot of the religious people who want to convert others have an arrogant kind of...what's the word...I guess hero complex where they think that they're right and they can save others by making them believe what they do. (Diagram THAT sentence, Webster!) Those people even use the word "save" in their goal, outright saying "If you don't believe this, you'll die." like religion is the bloody Potion of Lazarus. (Proper item?)

It's the same reason the mainstream people don't like furries or homosexuals. These groups are different and are either not mentioned in God's Plan or are supposedly cast down in the Bible, so the groups are labelled as evil, and therefore must be saved or simply killed.

But back to the topic of creationism. I think that the root of the debate basically came from that Evolution effectively is a step toward disproving the existence of God (Even though it doesn't, as God could still have created the universe, just have made the necessary bacteria and left it at that) and that the theory directly contradicts the Bible. Therefore, the consciousness is that a theory that opposes the bible opposes Christianity, therefore opposes God, therefore is an enemy and is therefore evil and shouldn't exist. Again, like the PTA moms who want to get rid of everything that opposes what's become the right-wing traditions.

Jad: Yeah, maybe a little harsh, but I see where you're coming from. I would have protested it myself if I had to do that in high school (I'm in College now.)

[Jad'Thor]

well, i have a lot of "mainstream people" at my school and they don't mind furries (however small the amount of furries at school there may be). apart from the people who saw "that CSI episode".

and i know what you mean (i think) some kid was explaining to some one that in some cultures/religions in particular country's gay's are considered evil and are killed :shcoked: i mean really, what is wrong with those people. im not gay my self but that doesn't mean its right for me (im using me as an example) to suddenly hate them and kill them because my "religion" says so and if i don't do it ill be considered "evil" and won't go to "heaven".

but anyway back to creationism, it is pretty far-feched that we all came from 2 people that suddenly appeared out of nowhere. this would be totally disgusting and would mean that everyone is inbred (ewwwww).

(and just to clarify in case you don't know me i have nothing against gay's or (most) religions as most of you probably know)

[artimus]

heh, I've reserved to thinking that everybody I meet is a gay-bashing arrogant fool until I know whether they really are. Guilty until proven innocent. It makes things easier for me. Although...for a community that's also considered taboo, I seriously doubt the good people here would reject another taboo community. This place seems to have really good people.

ANYWAY, Yeah, I've also had a problem with those. Like the Noah's Ark story implies that all living beings, except for those on the Ark perished in the flood. Well, I don't remember any records of a woman on the ark, so what about humans? Did God just yank another rib out?

Also, about the incest thing, Adam procreating with Eve would not only be incest, but it would be hedonistic and narcisistic, since Eve is, in a way, a female clone of Adam.

(BTW, I actually kinda liked that episode of CSI if not for the real truth of what happened. Also, I love when people try to make sense when they bash others. It's pretty hilarious.)

[Dan Witty]

Don't get me wrong, I don't care for established religion myself. I also feel creationiism has its place, but not in a school curriculum, I agree with you there as well. I just felt the need to point out the basic misunderstanding between the feuding ideas.

[artimus]

You know, I thought the best way to sum it up was in a rant by 2 The Ranting Gryphon (Not to plug) wherein he said "Well, does this mean that we can go to your churches and start teaching science?" Or something to that effect.

But, of course, if anyone brought up evolution in a church, they'd be considered a fool, right? amiright?

[WingedZephyr]

If anyone cannot manage to continue this discussion calmly, this thread will be locked. There's a difference between a discussion and an argument.

Keep in mind we have people from several belief systems and backgrounds here, and any one of them could read what you're saying. Bashing is not allowed.

[Jad'Thor]

i thought it was calmly......and what about the people that are completely insulted just by the concept of creationism (like me), thats my belief and im just expressing how i feel about it. and Artimus i completely agree with you that is a very good point. i myself would feel HEAVILY insulted if i had to put up with ANY religious stuff (for me this includes religious studies) in a public high school. if i was religious and i wanted to learn about "creationism" and my religion i would go to a religious school obviously, and if i preferred to be with friends in other non-religious schools i would have to live with the consequences that i would be taught like a non-religious student.  again im just stating a fact im NOT arguing with anything.

anyway im bored now and this could go on for ever, but i stand where i stand and that is that i can't stand creationism (and i don't care if any of you dislike or even HATE me because of it). im gonna go eat another mango or sumthin.....

[___]

Yea. I thought it was going pretty well compared to some other religion threads. If you wanna learn religion, go to church. If you wanna learn science, go to school. If you wanna learn about religion in school, go to a religious school. DON'T bring it to public school and try to force your beliefs on anyone else.

[artimus]

ok, ONCE AGAIN, I don't have anything against other religions and am NOT bashing them. Just because this discussion isn't filled with "lulz" doesn't make it an argument nor a bashing.

I don't really mind having religious studies in high school as long as it's an elective. I would have liked a history of religion class, really. That's why I'm taking one in college.